Original vs. Imitations of Ancient Coins

I thought the same, then saw that I had a few coincidences that I never knew I had! Fourees, etc...

 

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I still need to take my own picture of this coin but here's one that recently arrived that fits the theme:


This is a good silver(as opposed to fouree) imitation of an denarius of C. Calpurnius Piso Frugi, original prototype struck circa 61 B.C. This may be of Dacian origin but as multiple groups imitated these types it is impossible to say for sure without find spot evidence. What makes it even more interesting is that the particular series imitated is one that used unique control marks( on each die, so I was able to find a coin struck with the "official" dies that used this symbol pair(note: not my coin, thanks ArtCoinsRoma for the image):



Imitations of Roman Republic coinage, unknown group(possible Geto-Dacians), AR denarius(18mm, 3.59g), after 61 B.C. Types of C. Calpurnius Piso Frugi. Laureate head of Apollo right; behind, Π / Horseman right with palm; above, star; below, CΓISOLΓ. Cf. Crawford 408/1a, obv. die 6(Π), rev. die 14(star) for prototype

Also, I'd like to give a big thanks to @Volodya - I spotted this coin in a dealer's inventory, identified as a standard denarius(makes you wonder how closely he looked at it) and I was almost certain that it was an imitative and was ancient based on the style compared to others I'd seen, but Volodya's vote of confidence and discussion via PM made me feel much better about buying it

 

oh yeah, i forgot about my celtic imitative...

original (at least in style)....



danube celtic imitative...

 

The Shahi of ancient Afghanistan minted tens of millions of the horseman/bull jitals. The type would get imitated by later rulers. Here is an 8th-century coin of good silver and a 12-century imitative bronze of Mu'izz al-Din Muhammad (1171-1206), Delhi mint. The earlier coins are very easy to find, as they were extensively produced. Some of the imitations, like this one, are scarce...it's Tye 185.

 

Some of them as not so hard to find but hard to recognize due to a fad that went through the bull/horseman community making the dies much larger than the flans. JA's later example is a nice coin with very nice centering on the bull side. The horse is more typical but still not bad all things considered. Below is a bull (left and horseman right which are clearly what they are if you don't expect heads and tails on your animals. For the time being I'm calling it a MaHi PaLa from the 12-13th centuries but matching up the legends to others is not going well for me so I could be wrong. It has so much clear legend over the bull, I should be able to do better.


The same day from the same dealer for the same $4 price, I got the one below which matches MaHi PaLa in Tye (39) rather well. Are they both the same coin? Finding them was easy compared to finding out about them.

 

OH MAN, I LOVE that Jital!!!

 

Is it usually possible to tell a contemporary "imitation" from a more modern "decent" fake?

 

The Jitals are a fabulous series to see the evolution of copies of copies over centuries. Can make it hard though to distinguish them.
Agree on the attribution of the Tye#39. The "MaHi PaLa" is clearly readable above the bull. The Tye#148 is not correct, that's a Tye#185.
Here another Jital late copy. In fact it is a triple copy. As this likely is an inofficial local copy where the horse and bull side are based on coins of different rulers
(Mangubarni and Chahada Deva)

 

Yes, quite right. I actually have it attributed as 185 - 148 was a typo. Thanks!

 

fire altars!

 

Interesting thread.
One of my favorite RR moneyers is L.TITURI.SABIN because of the neat reverses, Tarpeia and kidnapping of the Sabine women.


Last week I bought an Imperial coin of Augustus with Tarpeia on the reverse. I will post more when the coin arrives in a few weeks.

 

Wow, I would have thought that the original coin was the imitation. Shows you how much I know which is nothing. I depend on trusted experts to tell me what's authentic.

 

Beautiful!!!

 

Recently picked up another Islamic coin that happens to be an imitation of a Byzantine coin:

Salduquds: Izz al-Din Salduq (1129-1168 CE) AE Fals, NM, ND (Album-1890)

Obv: Two standing figures with the one on the right holding a patriarchal cross on three steps in his right hand. This may be the Byzantine emperor John II Comnenus on the left and St. George on the right, but it could equally well be the Emperor Manuel I Comnenus and St. Theodore on the right.
Rev: Arabic legend on four lines - السلطان المعظم مسعود بن محمد عز الدين صادق بن علي (The Mighty Sultan Mas‘ud ibn Muhammad ‘Izz al-Din Salduq ibn ‘Ali)

Citing the Western Seljuq overlord Mas'ud, who ruled 1134-1152