Purchased a Julius Caesar lifetime portrait denarius from Roma Numismatics...NGC says it's fake

Very disappointed and surprised! Here's the ($5k) coin I purchased (link).


Julius Caesar AR Denarius. Rome, January - February 44 BC. P. Sepullius Macer, moneyer. CAESAR DICT PERPETVO, veiled and wreathed head of Caesar to right / Venus standing to left, holding Victory and sceptre resting on shield; [P•SE]PVLLI[VS] downwards on right, MACER downwards on left. Crawford 480/13; CRI 107d; BMCRR Rome 4173; RSC 39. 3.77g, 17mm, 9h.

Extremely Fine.

From the inventory of a UK dealer.

And the aftermath:



I have not yet reached out to Roma to invoke their lifetime authenticity guarantee - hopefully they do not give me any hassle. I know it's tough to judge from a photo alone, but any idea what could have tipped NGC off that this is a fake?

I would have thought Roma would take greater care in authenticating a higher-value coin like this prior to offering it in auction.

 

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That's a shame.
Did you pay with Paypal?

 

Given the invoice amount they required me to pay via bank wire, so no Paypal protection here unfortunately.

 

Don't see any on fake coin reports, either way, that sucks.

 

You can't expect the people at Roma to be as good at spotting fakes as Barry. He is a member here, so if you tag him, he might respond.

 

The lettering is sharp, but the surfaces look granular which would indicate a casting. This would have been a tough one for me to spot, but ancient coins are not my wheelhouse. There could also be an issue with the weight, or there could be something on the edge.

 

Man, sorry to hear that. I'm sure you won't have trouble getting your money back, but still what a hassle and a disappointment!

 

@Barry Murphy

 

Bummer!!

 

This is really terrible. I know how it feels. Have been there (not with Roma Numismatics) but not for such a pricey coin, and the dealer immediately apologized and gave me a refund. Based on Roma Numismatic's lifetime guarantee you'll surely get your money back.
Almost every day one can read about fakes flooding the market. It is so, so scary.

 

Why did you send it in in the first place?

The thing that sucks is that even if the coin is legit it's now Marked for Death regardless. No dealer or auctioneer will touch it again so knowing that why are you waiting on sending it back to Roma?

And who covers shipping and insurance in cases like this?

 

So, what were their reasons for condemning the coin? I take a very poor view of individuals and 'institutions' which proclaim something as not authentic without exhaustively showing their working. It has slightly rough surfaces but there is nothing I can see which would indicate a cast, at least not from Roma's photos. Have they provided parallels to back up their claim? Do features on the coin correspond to those connected with a particular known forger's work? Did they XRF the coin and find modern elements which would not be present in contemporary metal?

If they haven't bothered to furnish you with any of the above beyond 'because we say so', one avenue I think you should explore is looking for die-links. If you can find coins obviously struck from the same set of dies (or either rev/obv dies) that might assist you in making the case that the coin is actually fine. Either that, or tranches of other examples are also fake!

Remember - NGC are fallible too and do make errors of judgement (as seen by myself first hand with acres of mis-attributed coins in slabs). They are not judge, jury and executioner. Any company which styles itself as 'the' last word in providing authenticity is setting itself up for a big fall.

 

I don't like the coin (with apologies @Volante).
In my opinion, the portrait and the other devices are cut much too sharp compared to the many other examples of this coin. The style is in some, almost imperceptible way, wrong, again in my opinion.

Another thing that struck me: the individual letters are missing the little "blobs" which letters at this time typically had. I am comparing here to my own worn down example of this coin, which clearly shows these little blobs in spite of the wear.

 

Even though this area is out of my comfort zone and even though I also can't find a die match I'm now convinced the design is ancient. If it's a forgery it has to be a cast and one that's clever enough to slip through Roma's checks; a firm that has a lot of experience with this series (including at least a couple dozen Macers).

I think it would be a decent gesture to, at a minimum, get the rationale for condemning a coin of this caliber. With nothing else said it unfairly damages the reputation of the numismatist who ok'd it over at Roma and maybe also lowers the confidence of buyers who might wonder what other high grade forgeries might be circulating now. And all of this without consequence to NGC, whose reputation is above reproach in the opinion of the public.

Like I said in my first comment, as it stands that coin is now toxic no matter what. Nothing short of a public retraction could possibly rehabilitate it, the likelihood of which is probably zero. That reason alone is why I recommended OP just arrange for a refund right away. No matter how well grounded Roma's refutations to the contrary might be it won't be nearly enough to remove his doubt - or that of future owners.

Rasiel

 

Hi John. I'm not deep into this and I might be wrong, but at the obverse marked with yellow here, I can see flows of the metal, which is heavily suggesting it was struck:


Once again: I'm not deep into this and can be completly wrong, and want to be corrected if so.

 

That's weird. That coin was here 3 1/2 weeks ago but I have no recollection of it at all. That being said I see several dozen portrait denarii every week so they kind of run together. I do see in the database that both David and I independently came to the same conclusion that it was a forgery. If you would like to send it back in I can look at it again and give you an explanation.

Barry Murphy