Learning to grade Peace Dollars

Hi everyone. I am starting to collect Peace Dollars and am finding them more difficult to grade than more modern coins I started out collecting. The typically weak strikes are probably causing me the most difficulty, though I don't believe the strike factors into the grade. I am self-grading the attached 1922 coin at an MS-64; it has very nice luster, though it does have a weak strike (see "Liberty" on the obverse and "Peace" on the reverse") and some contact marks (which I don't believe are hairline scratches) on Liberty's cheek. I've attempted to capture an accurate photographic representation of this coin. What grade would you give it, and what types of things do you look for?

Thank you.

 

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Technically speaking, strike is an element of the grade, but, in practice, unless you have a very weak strike, it won't hurt the grade until you're looking at MS65 and above. I have seen some MS coins that could be mistaken for VF if not for the fact that they have full mint luster.

I don't really feel confident grading your coin from the picture, but, as far as the surfaces and strike go, MS64 seems reasonable.

What I'd advise you to do is go to a few shows and handle a lot of PCGS and NGC Peace dollars. I mean, don't monopolize a dealer's table if he has people waiting, but look at a lot of certified coins. Over time you will get better at recognizing what makes an MS63 vs an MS64, etc.

 

I agree with what Paul said as a weak strike usually won't affect a grade till a 65 , I also agree to look at as many slabbed coins in hand is the best way but not always practical unless you live in a large city with a lot of shows and shops . The next best thing is to look at a lot of pics of graded coins . Heritage has good pics and all the coins you could ever want to look at . Go to ha.com .

 

I do not collect those, but something looks off to me with that coin. Any others care to chime in?

 

Off as in fake? Or something else? The details all look right (besides, who would fake a '22 Peace?). I just thought the pic was a little off. It seems weirdly lit or something. That's why I didn't offer a grade opinion.

 

Yes, as in fake. But again, I do not collect these, so it might just be a weirdly lit pictures making it look funny to me.

 

Isn't that technically a very strong strike for a peace dollar? But on a flattened (non concaved) die which is not allowing the rim devices to form properly?

 

This will cost you the price of a subscription, but have you considered PCGS Photograde? I've included a link below.

http://www.pcgs.com/apps/

 

Here's a 66 for comparison. . .

 

Yes, it's a pretty darn good strike from poor dies. There's more hair detail in the center than you should reasonably expect of a Peace Dollar. I like this one at 64, and excellent pics, pr69!

 

I agree, nice strike and nice picture.

@pr69, what camera and lighting are you using?

 

Yes, as a fellow newbie, I'm also interested in your camera and lighting and any other details you might care to share.
Steve

 

Thank you for the helpful comments, everyone.

Wow, that's a very nice MS66 example, DUNK 2. Thanks for sharing. Also, with respect to PCGS Photograde, I have their app on my iPhone and it shows Peace Dollar examples (same as http://www.pcgs.com/photograde/#/Peace/Grades), and it helps me a little, but I still find some of the examples confusing. For example, their MS67 Peace Dollar has tremendously better eye appeal to me than their MS68 example. So I have consulted it occasionally, but when referencing it for my Kennedy Half Dollar collection I have found their photo examples to be even more confusing (their Kennedy Half Dollars have lots of toning which makes it more difficult for me to see the traits needed to certify a coin in an upper Mint State).

With regards to the strike -- I guess you are right, the hair looks very nice and was struck well. I was referring more to the text on the perimeter, which Cascade pointed out could be due to a flattened die, which had never crossed my mind. Interesting.

Now on to photography -- thanks for the positive feedback. My setup was as follows:

1. Halogen desk lamp positioned 12" above the coin.

2. iPhone 6 Plus, using the stock camera app. I positioned the phone about 6" above the coin, and moved things around a bit to reduce shadows.

3. I'm attaching the initial photo to this post -- you will see it has a brown hue. I was happy with this photo because it accurately shows all of the details in the coin, however it was not color accurate. This coin has a lot of mint luster and is definitely shiny silver in color, not brown or toned at all.

4. So I opened the original image on my Mac in the Preview app (included with the Mac OS X operating system), and moved the Saturation slide a bit until the color was accurate (to my eye) compared to the actual coin. My goal was not to "doctor" the image, but rather to produce as accurate of a representation as possible. I'm happy with the result. Except it seems impossible to capture mint luster in a photo.

 

Nice job editing the original picture! Thanks for the tip. Your original looks like most every picture I take.

 

Thanks, DUNK 2. I am attaching two more sets of photos (1923 and 1925) which were captured/tweaked the same way.

I self-graded these two coins MS-62 due to impaired mint luster (my 1922 is very lustrous); but the more I look at other graded examples the more I think these should be graded higher. Does anyone have feedback on these two coins? Thanks again.

 

Coin looks ok to me other than the weakness around the Lettering . Guess I forgot to post this after my initial post yesterday as it was still sitting here today .

 

Great pics for a phone . I have an iPhone 6 and never knew it could take such good pics . Are there any apps I should get to help with my coin pics or just keep practicing . I also wonder if it will fit on a copy stand ?

 

I'd say a 63 on both would suffice . Though you have them in hand and can see the luster and hits better .

 

rzage, thanks for the feedback. With respect to the iPhone 6, it has a fantastic camera. The only tips I have are: 1) turn your flash off, as that always seems to wash out pictures and the built-in camera takes usually great photos without it, 2) make sure you don't have a filter enabled (bottom right should have three grey circles, NOT colored circles), and 3) before you take a picture, tap on the screen near the center of the subject (e.g., tap on your coin, or tap on someone's face) and that will ensure it focuses properly, then take the picture.

 

Thanks pr69 , I just took the best pics of my life even better than my Sony DSC-H50 . Now to figure out how to get the pics into the forum posts .