I have been studying doubloons of eight recently. Anybody have one or more they would be willing to post pictures of and give a little history on the acquisition?
Great site! I also have this old 1960's catalog/book on the gold doubloons of 8 that lists many as unique or few existing. I was hoping to see if I could confirm or revise that information based on what members may possess.
Piezas de a ocho? Here is one - also called Peluconas due to the wigs worn by the spanish kings portrayed on these coins. This example came from the sale of the treasure recovered from the Spanish Merchant ship Nuestra Senora de la Luz. The ship went down in a storm off the bay of Buenos Aires on the River Plate around 1751. The sale was held by Sothebys, and contained approx. 1400 Doubloons, and many gold bars, artifacts, and jewelry recovered from the wreck. Bidders had the choice to have their coins cleaned of marine deposits, or left as is. I chose to have mine exactly as it was recovered. None of the item recovered were listed in the ships manifest. For this reason it is believed that the treasure was actually bootleg, taken by mule across the Andes and illicitly taken on board for the passage to Spain to avoid paying royal duties. The vast majority of the coins were minted at the newly opened mint in Santiago de Chile. Most of the doubloons were dated 1751, and only 150 or so specimens dated 1750.
Nice! Just found yours in my book. My book was published in Spain (I believe) in the early 1960's. At that time, the theoretical value of your coin was $225. What would you reasonably believe the value to be today? PS I will need to try and obtain a copy of that Sotheby's auction catalog.
I would suggest Cayon and Cayon if you wish to pursue Spanish coins, and other titles if you wish to pursue new world versions. Actually, the KM catalogs will do a fair job of giving you an overview of them. If you wish to collect coins from 1601-on, I would highly recommend getting KM catalogs. You can get an older edition for cheaper, (that is what I do), but everone simply used KM numbers, so its imperative to get these. Once you start to specialize, you will need specialized references like C&C.
At this time I would like to be knowledgeable. I do not yet have funds to delve into gold coins to compile a collection of any meaning. Besides, I am really getting into ancients. I may start a thread on suggestions on how to set out a certain series and then how to go about, in an organized manner acquiring that series. Right now I am am helter skelter and unorganized in my purchases.
There are definitely some scarce and even some rare pieces but as a general rule these coins are not scarce. A great many of them are quite common. I think you just need some newer, more up to date reference books.
I agree, I do need newer reference books, but I am a big believer in old reference as well because some important things are not necessarily carried forward in the latest works. I have found this especially true in my studies of the Mayan and Aztec cultures and peoples. Also, as I looked at my book more closely, it only covers the doubloons of four, as compared to the doubloons of eight when I originally posted. However, I welcome postings of all doubloons no matter where minted or of what denomination.
The 4 reales and the 4 escudos were always the ugly stepchild of the series, and far more of them are scarce than are the other denominations. That is because they always minted less of them than they did the other denominations as per the Royal Decrees that ordered them minted. It was much like it is with our coinage today, the small denominations are the workhorses so they always minted the most of them. The large denominations, the 8's, were primarily minted for shipment back to Spain to pay the Royal Fifth. And since the 4's were too big (too much money) to be used in most everyday commerce, they only minted a few.
Just a note on terminology, escudo was a gold coin, so a 4 escudo was more like our $10 gold piece. Also, "doubloon" is really not used by numismatists. Its more of a "treasure hunter" term for an escudo. If used, it usually refers to gold escudos of the earlier period where the striking of the coins were crude. For silver coins we usually just refer to them as 1,2,4 or 8 reales. Just letting you know Lonegun, as terminology can separate you as a knowledgable numismatist versus a "newbie" in front of a dealer. Chris
