CAC or one grade higher?

For the very same coin, let's say an honestly circulated type one double eagle with great eye appeal (or consider your own type coin) - If you had the opportunity to choose between an XF 40 grade and CAC certification VS XF45 and CAC failure - which would you choose? Which situation do you think would sell for more (obviously same TPG - either N or P). Which would be easier to sell?

(it happens I have two very similar looking coins - both lovely with lots of luster - and one is xf40 with CAC the other XF45 rejected by CAC. IMHO, either one could have gone the other way. So I wonder sometimes ......... FWIW!

Not including any pictures on purpose - use your imagination. Your opinions appreciated in advance. Thanks.

 

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I asked a similar question earlier in the week and didn't read anything after the first page cause the responses I got were ridiculous. Personally from my research I think the lower grade CAC would sell for more and if they look nearly identical as you mentioned, I'd go with that one.

https://www.cointalk.com/threads/green-or-gold-cac-sticker.308452/

 

If the coin was rejected by CAC, that means it is either a C coin for the grade (which is perfectly fine - still accurately graded, but will usually trade towards the lower end of the price band), or it has some problems (which is not okay). Without more information, it is really hard to say.

Within the same grade, the CAC coin will almost always sell for more than the non-CAC coin. However, there is no way to know if the coin was rejected, or just never submitted (unless you submitted it yourself).

When you start talking about different grades, there are just too many variables to tell you any generalization.

If you learn to grade for yourself, and only buy problem free, attractive, original pieces, CAC becomes significantly less important. It doesn't matter what CAC will or will not say, because you already know its a good piece! However, because the vast majority of collectors are not at this level, they rely on CAC to tell them if it is a good coin or not.

I realize that probably doesn't answer your question, but the mantra "Buy the coin not the holder" can just as easily be extended to "Buy the coin not the sticker."

 

Since your example is a gold coin where CAC can play a large role I would take the XF40 CAC. The grade difference between a 40 and 45 isn't a big one anyway

I think with the example given the 40 CAC would or at least the same as the 45. If you were talking XF to AU or F to VF the situation could easily change.

The CAC for gold coins.

 

+1

 

Not an expert but I believe CAC usually does a decent job when it comes to eye appeal and I only really collect eye appealing coins rather then ugly examples of the same grades. That is of course subjective, even to the CAC pros. I believe coins that have better eye appeal are much more fluid.

 

Sorry guy, everything you said makes sense, but no, you didn't answer the question. Question was - exact same coin - which would you rather have xf40 and CAC or xf45. It's really a business sort of question, not about which coin you would prefer or how to buy the coin rather than the holder. Exact same coin! Which, if you had a choice, would you prefer.

 

I see folks think the in gold coinage, one grade lower (and especially within the general category I suppose) that the CAC with lower grade is preferable. I agree. The coin I'm thinking most of in this regard is the one I have that is XF45 and my hunch is it would CAC at xf40. Lots of reasons, not the least of which is the comparison with a similar coin I have that is xf40 w CAC.

 

A related question - is CAC certification more of an asset with gold coinage than silver? Or is it a question of value? Any good type one double eagle is probably worth $2500 to $3000 or more - there's so much silver - good and interesting silver - available for less. Is it price or material that is the CAC value factor?

 

Like commodities trading, right? OK, then, I like the XF45. My rationale is, the XF40 CAC means that commodity is XF40 all day long and as such it doesn't trade in the higher EF45 commodities market. That CAC sticker is like a death sentence, holding that XF40 at XF40.

 

You know, I think you're right about that. In a similar way that a coin in an OGH is likely to stay there! I have a nice XF45 $1 (better date) that is both OGH and CAC. It might go AU50 if I cracked it, but I'm highly unlikely to do so! Also, I was thinking of cracking the XF45 $20 that I mentioned before - resubmitting and hoping for an XF40 so I could re-submit it to CAC - Hah! Not likely, but I have thought about it! It's an unusual coin - a fairly rare variety - and that may have figured into its grade. I think it's over graded by one grade and my hunch is that CAC thought so too.

 

Yeah, you're better with the higher grade. The stickers are pretty on the slabs, but they're strong second opinions the grades on the slabs are right.

 

If buying with the intention of keeping the coin for my personal collection, I’d buy the one I liked the best. I’d try to be educated about the market implications of a sticker (more important for some series than others) and the number on the holder, but this is really only important if a short-medium term sale is expected. With an anticipated long-term hold, the coin will likely be regraded/stickered/hologrammed/etc prior to the next sale anyhow. If you play the registry, crackout, regrade, resale, flip, or some other game, the correct answer for you might be different.

 

I would recommend you take both coins to a large coin show and get quotes from multiple dealers. See which one gets the higher offer. I think it may depend on the dealer, but I'm not sure the exact results you'd see.

For me as a collector (not looking to resell), if both the 40 CAC and 45 not CAC looked the same, I would buy whichever was less expensive.

 

I would go for a 40 with CAC. There are aspects associated with a CAC sticker, such as originality and lack of problems, that go beyond technical grade. And if a coin with a green versus gold sticker is “locked into its grade” then why are there so many resubmissions with upgrades but so few gold stickers?

 

I’d take the cac too. As it’s a quality coin for the grade higher end and problem free original skin. Rather have a high end 40 then a low end 45

 

As asked (it's the same coin and I can choose whether it's a 40CAC or 45 but same coin either way) I'd take the 45.

 

On a different note one of the cats just caced in the hallway

 

Kind of yes for both. The higher value the coin the more it can impact the value and originality is a big issue with gold

 

Are they priced the same? If so, I'd go with the CAC coin as they are likely the same value-wise, and the CAC will sell more easily if needed.

Is the CAC coin priced significantly higher? In that case I'd buy neither and wait for one just as nice that is within the going rate.

Is the CAC coin priced within the going rate for an EF-40 (ignoring the sticker). I'd go with the CAC one for obvious reasons.

But this is all based on holder/sticker/price, which is NOT the only way you should buy coins. Judge the coin itself, not the holder its in. CAC usually does a good job in spotting solid, accurately-graded coins from those that aren't, but I have seen a few that I disagreed with.

I (somewhat cynically) believe CAC stickers just give a dealer permission to charge significantly more for a coin because there is a very common misconception that the sticker means it is higher than the assigned grade.

And there is absolutely no chance of it being overgraded?