Anyone collect Elizabeth I, Edward VI or Henry VIII?

For my next purchases, I’m looking at starting a side collection in these three monarchs who fascinate me - Henry VIII, Edward VI & Elizabeth. I would love to have a nice big Henry VIII testoon most of all - these have an imposing facing portrait that is instantly recognisable of the famous king! For this project I’m wanting one coin of each denomination with reasonable portraits. Has anybody else gone down this path? Any particular things to be wary about when collecting this series?

And please show me your coins! (Sorry, I’ve got none - yet!)

 

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The early Tudors would be a great collection area Greg, and I agree that a testoon of Henry would be a grand coin to have. The one thing I would advise is that you may have to accept some pretty rough coins unless you are willing to pay high prices. Henry VIII introduced a policy of debasement in 1544 due to his lavish spending and involvement in continental wars. That policy would continue under his son, and by the time the policy was revoked in 1551 silver content was down to 25% from a previous 92%. During this Pettisthe quality of coins really suffered. So if you are looking for the classic bust of mature Henry (3rd coinage facing bust) the quality can be pretty low. His youthful profile bust from the 2nd coinage is much better in quality as silver quality was high, and the style is quite pleasing. Another aspect of this period is that Edward VI issued a large number of coins in his father's name and likeness.

My favorite busy of Henry VIII is from Dublin, and was minted under his son. Not my coin.

 

I do not 'collect' these but, since I collect generally, I have a few. Yes, I'd like a big fat testoon, too, but mine is a raggedy half groat.


If you are going to have an old, ugly Henry 8, you might also get a better looking face from earlier years like this halfgroat with reverse TC (Thomas Cranmer - thanks for the correction Talerman).


I have no E-VI but suggest a good Elizabeth would be one of the experimental 'Milled' coins like this sixpence of 1567.


Compared to the hammered coins like the 1578 3d below, the milled coins are rounder and more clear.

 

Fantastic info. And yes I’ve seen quite a few Edward VI coins with Henry VIII busts like the nice example you posted. I can afford one really nice top shelf centrepiece to my Tudor collection (like a Henry VIII testoon or a milled Elizabeth crown) among more modest pieces.

Is tooling and smoothing an issue to look out for, as it is with ancients?

 

I would definitely want examples of EI milled coins. The milled coinage of Elizabeth is a curiosity - I think they made them for about 10 years using a horse-powered screw press, after which they abandoned milled coins for half a century until the reign of Charles I (also a fascinating king - maybe I’ll go there too eventually!).

I’m finding with hammered coins it’s hard to find a portrait that isn’t worn blank at a good price. Here I may need to settle for coins with other problems (eg clipping) as a trade-off for a decent portrait.

 

You forgot Queen Mary too.

I have the others as well. Some with problems, but I am OK with it. They are still decent.


Mary (1553 - 1554 A.D.)
AR Groat
O: mΛRIΛ : (pomegranate) D’. G’. ΛnG'. FRΛ’. Z : hIB’. RЄGI’, crowned bust left; double and single annulet stops.
R: VЄRITΛ S (pomegranate) TЄm PORIS FILIΛ, royal coat-of-arms over long cross fourchée.
Tower (London) mint; im: pomegranate
23mm
1.86g
North 1960; SCBC 2492


Elizabeth I (1558 - 1603 A.D.)
AR Shilling
O: (key) ELIZAB’· D’· G’· ANG’· FR’· ET : HIB’· REGI, crowned and mantled bust left (bust 6B).
R: (key) POSVI DEV’· AD IVTORE M · MEV’·, coat-of-arms over long cross fourchée.
Sixth coinage. Tower (London) mint; im: key. Struck 1595-1598 AD
31mm
5.81g
North 2014; SCBC 2577


Henry VIII (1509-1547 A.D.)
AR Groat
Second Coinage
O: hЄnRIC’ VIII D’ G’ R’ ΛGLIЄ Z FRΛnCЄ, crowned bust right (Laker bust D); saltire stops, Lombardic lettering.
R: POSVI DEV’ ΛDIVTORЄ’ mЄV’, royal shield over long cross fourchée; saltires in forks, double saltire stops, Lombardic lettering.
Tower mint; im:arrow, 1526-1532 A.D.
25mm
2.55g
SCBC 2337E; North 1797


Henry VIII (1509-1547 A.D.)
AR Groat
Third Coinage
O: D. G. AnG. FRA. Z hIB. RЄX, , crowned bearded bust half right, rose after rex. , Laker bust A.
R: C[IVI] TAS BRIS TOLIЄ, royal coat-of-arms over long cross fourchée; lis in forks; pellet below third quarter of shield; rose after TAS, lis before BRIS; pellet on inner border.
Bristol mint; im: -/WS “monogram of William Sharrington” Struck circa 1546-1547.
2.45g
26mm
North 1846; SCBC 2372


Edward VI (1547 - 1553 A.D.)
AR Shilling
O: (tun) ЄDWΛRD’· VI : D’· S’ ΛGl’: FRΛ’· Z : hIB’· RЄX :, crowned and mantled bust facing slightly left; rose to left, XII to right.
R: (tun) POSVI DЄVM ·’ : ΛDIVTOR Є’· MEV·’·, coat-of-arms over long cross fourchée.
5.7g
32mm
North 1937; SCBC 2482

 

It's much less common on hammered coins, especially early medieval, but does happen from time to time. A lot of times it will be tooling legends to make them legible. Frankly the level of artistry on most medieval hammered coins just doesn't warrant tooling the way it does with ancients. A much more prevelant practice is straightening bent or folded coins. Sometimes it is done really well, other times very poorly.

 

IRELAND Henry VIII 1509-1547
AR Groat 25mm 2.5g
hЄnRIC VIII DI GR RЄX -
RΛnCIЄ ЄT hIBЄRnIЄ harp
H & R London SCBI 22 Copenhagen
Ex: @Mat




England - Elizabeth I 1558-1603 AR Sixpence 3rd-4th issue crescent mintmark



England - Elizabeth I - 1558-1603 AR Shilling



England Elizabeth I AR 3 Pence 1566 Her bust l rose shield 19 mm G Ex: FSR

 

Since I collect british coins as a generalist, I tend to go backwards in time and am approaching that period. My only one coin of the three monarchs you mentionned is an EI sixpence :



Although it's hammered and not milled, the portrait is still acceptable, and I got it for a smile (a big smile, but a smile)

Q

 

My 3 coins from that era: I like how they all have the fluer-de-lys on the coat of arms, and claim to be King/Queen of France, even though Queen Mary lost Calais in 1558, making the claim entirely fictional. England wouldn't drop the claim until the French Revolution left no throne to claim.
Henry VIII 2nd Groat 1526-44

Mary Groat 1553-4

Elizabeth I 6p 1581 5th issue

 

I've always wanted to get an 'Angel' and was luck enough to get one of Henry VIII, the only coin I have of the monarchs you mention. Nothing to advise on selection - I found it needed patience to wait until I could get one.
Obverse: St Michael, clad in a combination of feathers and armour, holding crossed-topped spear looking right with both feet on dragon being slayed, tail nearly touching left wing tip. Initial mark pheon. Beaded circle above and below legend of HENRIC VIII DI GRA REX AGL Z FRA
Reverse: Ship, with square topped royal shield, sailing right, bowsprit crosses rope, meets beaded line circle, h to the left of mast and clear of rope, rose to the right. Initial mark pheon. Beaded circle above and below legend of PER CRUCE TUA SALVA NOS XPE RED

 

When I actively collected British coins, I had very few hammered ones. But up until about five years ago, I did own very nice examples of a Henry VIII groat (with a portrait in profile that strongly resembled the one that appears on later groats of his father Henry VII), a couple of Edward VI fine shillings, a Philip & Mary shilling, and a 1582 Elizabeth I sixpence. Unfortunately, I had to sell all of them (and didn't take any photos before I sold them) except the Elizabeth I sixpence, which was the most worn of all of them, so I kept it. But it still has a very recognizable portrait, and I just posted photos of it a little while ago today in the "King's Day" thread. See those photos, with a detailed description of the coin, at https://www.cointalk.com/threads/kings’s-day.359060/#post-4416690.

As pointed out above, it's much easier to find a good-looking Henry VIII portrait in profile than one of the full-face ones, even though the latter are considerably more recognizable as his face. See these two very dubious-looking full-face examples currently on sale at VCoins:

https://www.vcoins.com/en/stores/de...ii_ar_groat_bristol_mint/1189215/Default.aspx

https://www.vcoins.com/en/stores/de...t_struck_under_edward_vi/1053268/Default.aspx

@dougsmit, regarding Thomas Cromwell and his family: his wife and two of his three children died (probably of sweating sickness) in 1529, several years before he rose to power under Henry VIII, and eleven years before his execution. So it isn't exactly fair to say he was spared this disease by the headman's axe! I know you've said you don't like historical fiction, but I do very highly recommend Hilary Mantel's Wolf Hall trilogy about Thomas Cromwell's rise and fall: the first two each won the Man Booker prize, and I just finished the third one, The Mirror and the Light, which was recently published.

 

I believe it is a lot to expect very thin coins to have good portraits and good legends. That requires the dies to be perfectly flat or complement the curve of the other die. If both dies are cupped in the same way, either the portraits or legends will be weak. I'm a fan of legends so both of my EI sixpence are weaker in the center. Unevenness is the standard. Note my 1571 is more worn but retains more profile while the 1593 is higher grade except for the fact the forhead is missing. Really nice coins of even this common type will sell for a considerable premium. The 1593 appears to have been bent and straightened.

 

Thomas Cromwell was a remarkable man but he was never Archbishop of Canterbury. The TC on these Canterbury coins is Archbishop Thomas Cranmer. Here is a half groat:

Henry VIII Half Groat 2nd coinage Canterbury issue with TC on rev. n.d. (1526-44)




Cromwell's predecessor, Thomas Wolsey (who, unfortunately for him, did not get the Anne Boleyn job done) was not only chief minister but also Archbishop of York. In that capacity he struck coins with TW on the reverse.

Henry VIII Half Groat 2nd coinage York issue with TW on rev. n.d. (1526-30)

 

Show me a picture of 1 so i know

 

Madding

 

Can't believe the stuff you members got laying around. Mines the Wisconsin leaf quarter. I missed placed it. Lol

 

I have posted these before on another thread but they seem relevant and additive to this one.

IRELAND Henry VIII Half Groat with crowned H & A on reverse n.d. (!534-36)

Henry and Anne formally married on 25 January 1533, after a secret wedding on 14 November 1532. She was crowned Queen of England on 1 June 1533. She was arrested on 2 May 1536 on charges of adultery and treason (probably fabricated), found guilty on 15 May and beheaded on 19 May



IRELAND Henry VIII Half Groat with crowned H & K on reverse n.d. (1540-42)

Henry VIII's fifth wife, Catherine Howard was still a teenager when she married the 49 year old Henry on 28 July 1540 , almost immediately after the annulment of his marriage to Anne of Cleves, to whom Catherine had been a lady-in-waiting. She was stripped of her title as queen on 23 November 1541 and beheaded three months later on 13 February 1542, on the grounds of treason for committing adultery with her distant cousin Thomas Culpepper, a courtier and a friend of the king. Culpepper had already been beheaded on 10 December 1541.

 

It took me a while to rummage through the boxes, but I was able to locate my Elizabeth I crown. I purchased this coin back in the mid-1980s, from a California coin dealer, Charlie Wyatt.

This particular coin was purchased by Charlie on a visit to Austria. It has a mint mark "1", which dates it to 1601, near the end of her long and illustrious reign.

As a hammer-struck coin, it does exhibit some doubling, but the main elements, most importantly her portrait, are clear. The coat-of-arms on the reverse is slightly doubled.

The Seaby catalog number for this coin is 2852.
Weight: 29.9 grams, 6 h.

 

Amazing coin! Exactly what I want!